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[SC] An ongoing problem with pushing bans.

Discussion in 'General Archive' started by BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ, Dec 16, 2016.

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  1. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    Why do I never see realistic questions about support team in surveys? Why is it questions that have been passed to them for the purpose of getting an answer from the team never get there? I know the handful of us on the English thread cant be the only ones asking questions and waiting for a good answer.

    When will we see changes to non-legit pushing bans? And will any actions be taken to right the wrongs? Why does the support team seem to make up rules on the fly that are not in any rules in the game but are just their interpretation of these rules and when I ask for proof I get half an answer with a link to rules "sometimes not" then they close the ticket.

    Why is nobody watching the performance of support team? Or is [removed] the only one working their now? And is she allowed to erect rules on the fly?Why are players allowed to fight people , lose , change their name and come back to die some more? And when your in the middle of a big fight you shoot anything trying to take you out so the Idea that someone would "Change their name to incite a pushing ban" would not be on your mind. When will this game finally address this issue?

    Howmany newbies have been smashed by ufe and received a pushing ban because the ufe would not stop hunting them, and as a good player you cant defend the newbies because you risk getting your self banned for pushing because these noobs will keep coming back for newbie kills and even change their names in the process.... And you wander why people leave or quit at the beginner stage? I`d quit any game that just banned me for getting popped the day I started.

    I myself have already been banned and punished for pushing, because the UFE noob changed his name and continued to hunt me down then you add in its possible to take locks no-matter who is shooting the target or how hard they are shooting.Your chances of getting banned for pushing is doubled. So experienced players are faced with "I have to log out to avoid getting banned because Darkorbit doesn`t monitor people who intentionally incite pushing bans on other players"

    The problem with this game right now is the support team. All the new updates are nice theres more variety and possible more of that to come but. Nothing has been done about the support teams poor efforts to take care of the players so if you want to show you`re for the players that would be a great place to start.
     
    Last edited by moderator: Dec 16, 2016
  2. .[NightMare].

    .[NightMare]. Forum Baron

    Hi,

    Each case of pushing is reviewed manually and more often than not looked at by at least 2 people along the way. Wehn those cases are looked at, it is the account number that is reviewed. This way we can eliminate anybody changing the name to try to hide the fact. The guidelines on how to handle pushing are quite clear and should there be any doubt, they are always reviewed and handled appropriately. Sometimes this means an account will not receive a pushing penalty. Sometimes it will.

    I might add that all parties involved are investigated individually and handled appropriately.

    If you have an issue personally with a pushing penalty then you should make fair representation through the proper channels.

    Regards

    CA_.[NightMare].

    note - thread will be left open for fair reply but will be closed should this turn into a mod/support bashing thread
     
  3. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    The problem is the only option to the issue is through support who has already stated they dont care. How else am I to make the issue known? I bought uri on helix last year which gave me a good rank boost , and before the hitac frost event started I received a pushing ban where I was punished not being able to log in for 2 weeks and lost 30% ep and honor. Honor and ep that my helix paid for prior to the ban.

    I sent an email to support when it was obvious certain players were tracking me down and I never got a reply on that ticket just the automated "We will get back to you message" I`d share pictures of the convo but I know that would get the thread closed so cant.I never though people were crazy enough to change their names and continue hunting me down and the fact I was doing alot of pvp that day with some pirate quest theres no way I could track down which name changed.So are we to log off the game now because other players dont like us to the point they incite pushing bans?

    So that support isnt helping, what now? When can we see something positive in the game? Eye candy, updates those are to be expected which is good... But false pushing bans is an issue. When will it be addressed?

    The whole time im in the game im helping people get better at the game, all I do is help people. So now that i`ve come across this issue where is my help?And what about the newbies who received the cruel welcome to the game pushing ban?
     
  4. If you continue to kill someone after getting the message that this player is worth nothing to kill because he is to weak for you, you should expect to get punished, that is a main reason for the anti griefing policy.
     
  5. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    That message is rarely displayed. Easiest way to combat this is to simply not gain any points after having killed a player x amount of times, which is something they claimed they would do before and we all see that didn`t happen. It literally feels as if they want to use pushing bans to boost the number of bot bans they dish out.
     
  6. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    Just to keep the thread up and to clarify alittle.

    Enforcing pushing bans recently like what has been done was not the best choice.We still have lock based bugs were the weakest player, or last player shooting could take lock from another player when that player or players was already shooting the target. I know all the active veteran players remember when lil noob vengis were notorious for taking locks on old client and after bio came out.

    Then we have people changing their names after being destroyed 5 times while attempting to take on a player or players. And no the system does not engage the "This player is too weak for you" message at that point.

    Again not trying to bash anyone but why was my concerns and discussions never passed along to someone who could address the issue?
    My conversation to support team started last year before the frost hitac started. and it got no where. o_O.


    Just what to make my point of view more clear. I look forward to some improvement somewhere.

    And to the team "Everyday is a day to improve" I believe you people can do better and keep doing better or else I wouldn`t be here :cool:
     
  7. Solid_Eye

    Solid_Eye Board Administrator Team Darkorbit

    To be clear, your past complaints on this were passed on. We've raised concerns on pushing periodically so the team are aware. However it is hardly the only concern in the game and not the only thing that needs looked at, not to mention how the game team etc might feel it ranks against other pressing issues.

    Regards,
     
  8. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    Does the team have any more info on this that can be shared?
     
  9. Yea but they change there names so you cant just know for sure it is the same person that is what bman is saying, for example you get reduced rewards to nothing then the player changes their name and keeps flying to/shooting you in group battle or events and you need to defend yourself or die. So you defend yourself against them and then you get the punishment because you did not know it was the same person who just changed there name, and I completely agree with the aspect of not being able to see the statements of recieveing reduced rewards/warning as you are in a PVP heavy environment and you focused on defending yourself and popping the enemies.
    I have had players attempt this with me as well recently and it is kind of scary and sad that legit players are at risk to this kind of flaw in the game. There needs to be an addition or implementation to better sort this problem.
     
  10. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    So there was a fix today and it read.

    Hello everyone, We have just performed the sync for release week 5.
    Please take a look below for the contents. · The amount of RSB-75 and UCB-100 dropped by the UFO and Ufonit has been reduced · The amount of Proxium needed to craft the Unstable LF-4 has been reduced · Unstable LF-4 is now the tier 2 reward for the event · Amount of Proxium required for RSB-75 is increased, and it is now the tier 4 reward

    Updated recipes · Green Booty Key + 1 Duothrin – 15 Proxium · U-LF4 + 1 Trittothrin – 25 Proxium + 1 Duothrin · Extra Energy 500 + 1 Quadrothrin – 30 Proxium + 1 Trittothrin · RSB-75 40K – 130 Proxium + 1 Quadrothrin Bugfixes ·
    Fixed the exploit where users could receive Proxium when suiciding against a UFO.
    We are currently looking into possible ways to remove items gained by using this exploit. Punishment outside of item removal is not currently planned. ·
    Added the hangar video for the Ocean Venom · Fixed an issue that caused the incorrect amounts of items to be displayed after they were booked in from the ammunition broker

    Now I have 1 question with this. Its simple really but apparently folks skipped over it or just threw something in.
    "Punishment outside of item removal is not currently planned"

    This seems like bug abusers don`t get punished which is something that is done intentionally especially the proxium bug that players were using. So why is it an average player can get punished for pushing even when that player is changing maps and flying with a group to avoid having to fight these people?Thats a removal of 30% ep and honor because other players are upset enough to chase this player all over the game.

    But intentional bug abuse has no serious repercussions?
    Seems alittle one sided.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  11. XeonXS

    XeonXS Someday Author


    Firstly, I am chronically against bug use, but this is a silly post.
    I don't know if you are aware of what the bug entails, but since it has been patched I will explain: The user buys a lot of lives with uridium, and then suicides against the UFO, which then gets converted into RSB. Essentially this gives 'cheap RSB' where 1 round of RSB costs roughly 1 uridium (if you spend $ on boosters).
    If they remove all ammo gained from this, the bug user will still lose all the uridium spent on extra lives for the gate. BP usually also do heavier punishments against players who exploit a bug more than others, (when the honour bug was around, they perma banned bug abusers which gained over x honour for example) and the same applies internally here.
    If the user spends 5mill uri on 5 mill RSB, and 5 mill RSB gets removed, the user is 5mill uri worse off than before.

    5 mill uri = £300+

    Personally I believe this punishment is completely justified, but also absolutely brutal for those who exploited this to the max. There is implicit punishment, seems about right. Therefore no extra punishment is required (imo).
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2017
  12. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    My point was bug abuse is intentional and in "some cases" isn`t so harsh.

    But pushing bans "without intentional" coordination of giving x amount of ship kills to a player.If a newbie starts the game we all know players bigger than them will pop them everytime they see them and then the new player and the bigger player gets banned for pushing. New player quits.

    These pushing bans in many ways are far more serious when its something that is hardly ever intentional. Like how people can change names and continue chasing after the same group on a server because they are up set about losing their fight and end up getting popped 5 more times or so. The people they are chasing are not going to keep refreshing their logbook while fighting to try and count kills on certain names as it makes your client flight page skip a few seconds which we all know if you cant react for a few seconds your toast unless someone really awesome saves you from a logbook. But the penalty is reduction of 30% ep and honor, regardless of intentional pushing or not.

    And for all we know these people abusing bugs may only buy premium and "Zombie mode" boxes late at night. Recent ban caught 19 players... I know there is waay more than 19 zombies on my server every night.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2017
  13. STARLIGHTHUSTLE

    STARLIGHTHUSTLE Forum Master

    This is my first time in Speakers corner and I'm glad I decided to see what was here. I have played this game for several years and I still find it hard to believe that players would go to such extremes to win . Just recently I was in a situation where I knew I had been auto-locked . And the bottom line is, ITS JUST A GAME . I want to win too. but , not bad enough to cheat! I hope that someday these players will realize that being top in this game will not get you wealth , prestige , money or girls . So try to have a little fun and don't take this game so seriously .
     
  14. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    So on the topic of pushing bans and how getting a players kill is rarely orchestrated and obtaining a players kill more than once is pretty easy given there is less players now than several years ago when pushing rules came about. But here is a short video showing the "Lock/kill bug" still exist in the game today.And can cause support to assume you`re pushing when the system is just tossing the wrong players the kill count.
     
  15. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    UPDATE: I will be showing what configs I used when I was accused of pushing. Hoping support or dev team could get a better idea of what I was seeing.
     
  16. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    Here is my demonstration of my configs.


    And this is the fight I was in with those configs.


    And you can see im running defensive role just soaking up dmg not really dishing anything out and only had x2 and rsb at the time of that fight.
     
  17. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    So DO`s Baracus/Ron lightly touched the false pushing bans in the last twitch stream. Which its good to be on top of this but to say that most the pushing bans are correct is like telling those of us who got the raw end of it to just accept it. Which we shouldn`t.

    Especially when players would go to great lengths to get other players banned for pushing when they them selves couldn`t pop the people they are trying to get banned nor were they being hunted repeatedly by the players they are harassing. So there is no sane reason as to why these players go to great lengths to get people banned. Like they see it as a huge problem they cant beat these other players. And its sad that players were successful in getting others banned for pushing.

    I actually thought "Theres no way DO would allow something like this to go on" and boy was I wrong. And the reason I never thought it would be possible is because if you pop a player x amount of times and they just wont quit chasing after you , the only option is to log off because they wont quit untill they see you off the game which means those players are deciding when the people they are after has to stop playing for the day. And to me thats not their decision to make.

    And if you do run with a group it doesn`t help unless you let everybody fight for you since locks are still bugged even with you hitting the player last you can still get the kill which is a bug that I have seen in the kill since 2010 "Pretty sure folks remember when , This newbie vengi just stole my kill!!" and they were doing 600 with x1s lol.

    But unfortunately it doesn`t matter because when support or whoever else is allowed to check your logs is going to see x amount of kills and write it off as you were pushing.

    I had 11.3 billion ep and 101.6 million honor with the -30%.
    I lost 3,390,000,000 ep and 30,480,000 honor. When I got penalized which was after running gates I built from helix.

    I do hope this gets a fix at some point.
     
    neoonoma likes this.
  18. neoonoma

    neoonoma Forum Great Master

    The only way to solve this is by making a clan and sending war to that weaker player's clan.Because for some reason when you do that you do not get banned.
     
  19. BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ

    BMλŋ916-ƒliesUSƒlaǧ Forum Commissioner

    Yeah just my luck they would still ban me. Resulting in a 30 day suspension and an additional reduction of 60% ep and honor.

    I see toomany bug exploiters, pushers and even late night "zombies" somehow avoid these ridiculous bans, but those of us who are good at the game and not in those circles have to be mindful of everybody we shoot on to avoid serious repercussions as I experienced with the pushing ban. Seems if we get in the way there are dedicated accounts that will gladly take a pushing ban to hinder the player they cant beat.
     

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